Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Scaling Smarter: Building Sales Teams with Steve Caton – Episode 136

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Scaling Smarter: Building Sales Teams with Steve Caton – Episode 136

What does it take to scale a sales organization in today’s unpredictable business environment? In this dynamic episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Sean O’Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson welcome back Steve Caton, CEO of Altezza Solutions, to unpack the nuances of scaling sales teams, especially through the power of fractional sales professionals. Together, they explore the critical role that sales processes, sales management, and business acumen play in enabling organizations to grow without overspending or compromising performance. Whether you’re navigating the “zero to one” phase or planning your expansion from one rep to five, this episode offers a roadmap for smart, sustainable revenue generation.

Key Topics Discussed

  • Zero to One vs. One to One Hundred: Two Models for Scaling Sales Teams (00:01:14)
    Kevin and Steve outline the difference between launching your first rep and accelerating team expansion, with a focus on structured growth.
  • Fractional Salespeople as a Low-Risk Growth Strategy (00:02:45)
    Steve explains how the fractional model supports learning, experimentation, and ROI without overcommitting resources too early.
  • Determining the Right Time to Expand Territories or Add Headcount (00:04:10)
    The team discusses key signals—like activity level, lead flow, and deal volume—that indicate when it’s time to grow.
  • Using Leading Indicators vs. Lagging Indicators in Sales Management (00:06:16)
    Steve shares the importance of measuring inputs (calls, meetings, proposals) over outputs (closed deals) to ensure predictable scale.
  • The Power of Process-Driven Selling for Sales Success (00:13:08)
    Sean and Steve emphasize why experienced sales pros rely on systems, not improvisation, and why process must precede people.

Key Quotes

  • Kevin Lawson (00:01:34):
    “Think hockey stick versus gradual—zero to one is about getting that first good hire. That’s when you unlock real scale potential.”
  • Steve Caton (00:02:45):
    “Start small, see what works, then expand. That’s the foundation of scalable revenue—and the fractional model makes that possible without spending a crazy amount of money.”
  • Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:08:00):
    “Sales is about finding the customer that is going to buy—that’s not just a marketing thing, that’s a sales thing.”
  • Steve Caton (00:13:08):
    “Process comes before people. If there’s no process, your reps will build one—and that distracts them from actually selling.”

Additional Resources

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast

Use leading indicators—not just closed deals—to decide when it’s time to grow your sales team. Many companies scale reactively, hiring after success arrives. But Steve Caton challenges leaders to evaluate the activity level of their reps—calls made, meetings scheduled, deals created—to make data-driven decisions before hitting a bottleneck. If your top performer is maxing out their productive hours, it’s time to split territories, not overload. Review your leading indicators this week and see where your next growth step should begin.

Why You Should Listen

This episode is a must-listen for founders, CEOs, and sales leaders trying to build smarter, not just bigger. With deep insight into the value of fractional sales professionals, the importance of sales strategies, and how to use data for effective revenue management, Steve Caton offers a practical, grounded view of what scalable sales success looks like. If you’re serious about growing your team without growing your headaches, hit play and take notes.

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Know Your Numbers: A Sales Leader’s Guide to Growth Metrics – E132

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Know Your Numbers: A Sales Leader’s Guide to Growth Metrics – E132

As Q2 kicks into full gear, it’s time to pause and reflect—are you ahead, on pace, or falling behind on your sales targets? In this insightful episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey unpack one of a sales leader’s most crucial yet often overlooked responsibilities: knowing your numbers. With equal parts practical advice and strategic vision, this conversation walks you through the foundational metrics every sales leader should track—customer acquisition cost, average transaction size, support staffing ratios, and more. Whether you’re forecasting growth, scaling headcount, or simply trying to stay ahead of the competition, this episode is your playbook for building a metrics-driven sales organization that thrives.

Key Topics Discussed

  • Why “Keeping Score” Matters in Sales Leadership (00:00)
    Kevin kicks off the episode with a strong analogy to competitive sports, emphasizing that tracking performance metrics is non-negotiable for sales leaders aiming to grow.
  • Building a Forward-Looking Sales Metrics Matrix (00:01)
    Kevin walks through how to build a simple but powerful matrix using transaction volume, average deal size, and headcount to visualize both current performance and future goals.
  • Calculating Average Transaction Size and Quota Coverage (00:02)
    Learn how to reverse-engineer quota achievement by dividing sales goals by average transaction size to determine activity targets for your team.
  • Understanding Customer Acquisition Cost (CAC) (00:05)
    Sean breaks down the components of CAC and explains why every sales leader must know this figure to scale sustainably and profitably.
  • Debunking the “Geopolitics Are Killing Sales” Excuse (00:09)
    Sean challenges the notion that global events are valid reasons for missed quotas, reinforcing that internal execution and strategic clarity are what really matter.
  • Aligning Sales Activity with Strategic Growth Goals (00:12)
    Kevin closes the episode with a systems-thinking approach to leadership, showing how small adjustments in metrics, team development, and compensation can drive exponential growth.

Key Quotes

Kevin Lawson: “Keeping score is important. Really important. I’m talking like March Madness. Final game. Important.” (00:00)

Sean O’Shaughnessey: “If it takes you more than 20 minutes to figure out this information, then you need a better bookkeeping system.” (00:06)

Sean O’Shaughnessey: “You need to know what your average deal size is. You need to know how long it takes you to get a customer. Your CRM should be solving that.” (00:07)

Kevin Lawson: “We want to gently steer our company towards our goals. So the thinking about this process is all about knowing your numbers.” (00:12)

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast

Build Your Sales Metrics Matrix This Week
Start with your annual revenue goal. Break it down by the number of salespeople, average transaction value, and number of transactions needed per rep per month. Then layer in your customer acquisition cost, support staffing ratios, and expected margin. This matrix becomes your roadmap for scaling intelligently—whether you’re doubling headcount, expanding territory, or just trying to hit a consistent quota.

Episode Summary

In a world of uncertainty, Two Tall Guys Talking Sales reminds us that clarity comes from data. Kevin and Sean deliver a compelling, no-nonsense discussion about how to take control of your revenue engine by genuinely understanding the math behind your sales motion. Whether you’re a CEO, VP of Sales, or just starting to lead a team, this episode offers an essential primer on aligning your operations to your goals. Don’t miss this one—it might be the wake-up call your spreadsheet has been waiting for.

👉 Hit play now to future-proof your sales strategy by learning how to know your numbers like a pro.

Level Up Your Sales Prospecting with Advanced Research Techniques

Level Up Your Sales Prospecting with Advanced Research Techniques

A shoutout to Chris Spanier and Episode #85 of the Practical, Actionable Marketing Podcast

Sales prospecting has always been a grind. What if you could cut your research time in half and dramatically improve your outreach results?

In Episode #85 of the Practical, Actionable Marketing podcast, host Chris Spanier delivers a masterclass on how to do just that. Titled “Advanced Prospecting Research Tools,” the episode is packed with time-saving techniques and tools that help sales professionals build sharper prospect profiles faster.

As someone with over four decades in sales and sales management, I believe this kind of tactical insight makes a difference. If you haven’t already, listen to the episode. Then, come back here for a quick breakdown of what Chris covered—plus a few of my thoughts.


Why Prospect Research Matters More Than Ever

In a market saturated with sales messages, relevance is your only competitive advantage. The days of blasting generic emails to massive lists are over. Today, the winners are the ones who personalize their outreach with precision—and that begins with better research.

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Why Cold Calling is Dead: The Shift to Relationship-Based Selling

Why Cold Calling is Dead: The Shift to Relationship-Based Selling

Building an effective sales pipeline requires a shift in strategy. Traditional cold calling has become increasingly ineffective, with decision-makers ignoring unsolicited calls and emails.

In the spring of 2021, Bank of America Corp.’s Merrill Lynch Wealth Management unit banned trainee brokers from making cold calls. According to the Wall Street Journal, it is hard to succeed with cold phone calls in an era when no one picks up. Merrill executives said personal referrals lead to a response around 40% of the time, but less than 2% of people who are cold-called even answer the phone.

Sales teams must adopt a more strategic approach, focusing on relationships rather than volume-based outreach. The key is leveraging existing networks to create warm introductions, significantly improving engagement rates and overall success.

Cold outreach has become expensive and inefficient, and the time spent dialing numbers, leaving voicemails, and sending emails that never get opened results in diminishing returns. Many executives no longer answer unknown calls, and email filters automatically sort cold outreach into spam. Even when messages get through, recipients are skeptical, assuming they are generated by automation rather than a genuine human connection. In reality, sales professionals must find a better way to reach their target audience.

Relationship-based selling offers a more effective alternative. Salespeople should focus on leveraging their connections instead of reaching out to strangers. This approach involves identifying key contacts who can provide warm introductions to potential prospects. These “super connectors” are individuals with strong networks and the ability to facilitate meaningful introductions. By tapping into these relationships, sales teams can bypass the skepticism associated with cold outreach and start conversations with credibility.

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Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Sales Prospecting: Are You Chasing Leads or Cultivating Success? – E127

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Sales Prospecting: Are You Chasing Leads or Cultivating Success? – E127

In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey dive into the art of sales prospecting using an unusual but powerful analogy—chasing butterflies versus building a garden. Are you tirelessly running after leads or cultivating an environment where ideal prospects naturally come to you? Learn how to create a long-term strategy for consistent revenue growth by positioning your business as the go-to solution for your ideal customers.

Key Topics Discussed:

  • The Butterfly Effect in Sales (00:01:00) – The difference between chasing every lead and strategically attracting the right ones.
  • Building a Sales Garden (00:02:49) – Developing a long-term strategy that consistently nurtures and attracts the best-fit prospects.
  • Marketing & Content Strategy Alignment (00:04:22) – Collaborating with marketing to ensure the right messaging.
  • The Value of Inbound Leads (00:06:11) – Why leads that come through your marketing efforts are often easier to close and more profitable.
  • Tactical Steps for Sales Leaders (00:08:00) – Actionable insights for sales managers to help their teams attract, engage, and convert better.
  • Crafting a Strong Value Proposition (00:10:18) – The foundation of effective lead generation and how to align it with your ideal customer profile.

Key Quotes:

  • Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:01:52): “If you’re hungry for revenue, you’re probably running around chasing butterflies. But if you want sustainable growth, you need to create an environment where prospects naturally come to you.”
  • Kevin Lawson (00:03:55): “Sales leaders, think about your team—have you equipped them with butterfly nets, or have you taught them how to build a garden?”
  • Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:06:44): “The best prospects aren’t the ones you chase—they’re the ones who find their way to your garden because you’ve built something valuable for them.”

Additional Resources:

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast:

If you rely solely on outbound prospecting, evaluate your value proposition and content strategy today. Align your marketing and sales teams to ensure your messaging is clear, consistent, and tailored to your ideal buyer. Identify gaps in your digital presence and take the first step toward creating a sales garden that nurtures and attracts the right leads.

Final Thoughts:

Sales is more than just chasing down deals—it’s creating an ecosystem where prospects feel drawn to your expertise, insights, and solutions. In this episode, Sean and Kevin explain shifting from frantic outbound prospecting to a methodical approach that fosters sustainable revenue growth. Whether you’re a sales leader or an individual contributor, you’ll walk away with practical steps to build your high-converting sales garden.

Tune in now and take your sales strategy to the next level!

To understand if your company is doing a great job in sales, take this quick and easy assessment: https://newsales.expert/b2b-sales-capability-assessment/

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Measuring Marketing Success with Amy Connor of CMO OnLoan – E126

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Measuring Marketing Success with Amy Connor of CMO OnLoan – E126

Welcome back to another episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales with Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey! This week, we’re diving deep into measuring marketing effectiveness with special guest Amy Connor, founder of CMO OnLoan. If you’ve ever struggled to connect marketing strategies to real business results, this episode is for you. Grab your marketing colleague and tune in—understanding what’s working (and what’s not) in your marketing is the key to driving sales growth.

Key Topics Discussed:

  • The Importance of Measuring Marketing Performance (01:08)
    Many companies don’t effectively track their marketing impact. Amy shares how focusing on key metrics—without overwhelming dashboards—can create a direct path to success.
  • Sales and Marketing Must Be Aligned (02:09)
    Customers don’t see marketing and sales as separate—they see one company. Amy explains why integrating both functions is crucial for a seamless customer journey.
  • Why Vanity Metrics Don’t Matter (02:55)
    Impressions, clicks, and leads may look impressive, but if they don’t translate to business results, they don’t matter. Learn how to focus on meaningful data that connects to revenue.
  • The Billboard Advertising Myth (03:12)
    Can a billboard drive B2B sales? Amy and Sean discuss the realities of traditional advertising and why small businesses should think critically about marketing spend.
  • Aligning Sales Messaging with Marketing Content (05:57)
    Sales teams shouldn’t be the only ones communicating key messages. Amy shares why marketing content must reinforce what salespeople say to build trust and shorten sales cycles.
  • Tactical vs. Strategic Marketing – What’s the Right Balance? (08:29)
    Should your marketing focus on brand awareness or immediate sales action? Amy explains the difference and how to measure each effectively.

Key Quotes:

Amy Connor: “Marketing and sales are part of the customer’s journey in a united way. The customer doesn’t see ‘marketing did this and sales did that’—they see the company as a whole.” (01:45)

Sean O’Shaughnessey: “Salespeople start at a disadvantage because buyers inherently don’t trust them. That’s why marketing must reinforce their message to build credibility.” (05:40)

Kevin Lawson: “Up to 70% of the buyer’s journey happens before they talk to sales. If marketing isn’t working ahead of time, you’re already losing.” (07:52)

Additional Resources:

  • Visit CMO OnLoan for free marketing resources: www.cmo-onloan.com
  • Connect with Amy Connor on LinkedIn: Amy Connor LinkedIn
  • Listen to the first episode featuring Amy: Last Week’s Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/amy-connor-discusses-salespeople-vs-lead-generation/id1668686029?i=1000693738159

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast:

Audit Your Marketing Metrics
Take 30 minutes this week to assess what marketing data your company is tracking. Are you focusing on impressions and clicks or lead conversion and revenue impact? Identify one metric that directly connects marketing activity to business growth and make it your priority.

Why You Should Listen to This Episode

Marketing is more than just branding—it’s a revenue-driving function. In this conversation, Amy Connor unpacks how B2B companies can measure what truly matters, align sales and marketing, and ensure every dollar spent on marketing contributes to the bottom line. If you want your marketing efforts to drive real sales results, don’t miss this insightful discussion. Tune in now!

Building Winning Sales Teams for the Future: Insights for CEOs and Sales Leaders

Building Winning Sales Teams for the Future: Insights for CEOs and Sales Leaders

What are the key moves that CEOs and sales leaders must make to prepare their teams for success in 2025? That’s exactly what we explored in a recent episode of the Art and Science of Complex Sales podcast hosted by Paul Fuller of Membrain. I had the pleasure of joining Kevin Lawson, President of Lighthouse Sales Advisors, for a deep dive into the strategies defining high-performing sales organizations in the year ahead.

You may recognize Kevin’s name. He is my co-host on the Two Tall Guys Talking Sales podcast. Paul titled our interview with him “Building Winning Sales Teams for the Future with Two Tall Guys.”

In the episode, we uncover the real-world tactics and leadership insights that can help CEOs transform their sales organizations—from defining who to sell to building processes that deliver consistent results. If you’re serious about leading a sales team that thrives amid complexity, I highly encourage you to listen to the full conversation. The link is below—don’t miss it.

Driving Growth Through Data-Driven Leadership

One of the central themes we cover is the role of data in guiding strategic decisions. Successful sales leadership today hinges on the ability to read the right signals—metrics like call volumes, deal velocity, customer life cycles, and attrition rates. We discuss how to turn that data into insights that refine your ideal customer profile (ICP) and strengthen your sales and marketing efforts.

We also discuss how a CEO’s dashboard isn’t static. It must evolve based on the business environment, market pressures, and geopolitical events. Paul Fuller helps steer the conversation into practical territory, where we explore how CEOs can stay ahead by making data-informed decisions and leading their teams with clarity and focus.

This podcast episode will be particularly valuable if you’re a CEO or revenue leader aiming to refine your strategic lens. Be sure to check it out through the link below.

Coaching for Consistent Performance Improvement

Data might show you where to focus, but coaching is what gets you results. Kevin and I discuss the importance of coaching for incremental gains—not just pushing reps to hit more numbers but helping them level up in ability and mindset.

We show how leaders can move salespeople from C-level to B-level performers and beyond through relatable sports analogies and real-world examples. These small, steady improvements compound over time and create a team of confident, capable sellers who know how to win.

We also touch on the need for structured coaching frameworks and repeatable systems, which we provide through website resources. If you lead a team that could benefit from a morale, performance, or accountability boost, this is a conversation you won’t want to miss.

Building a Repeatable, Scalable Sales Process

We close the episode with a focused discussion on sales process discipline. By taking a structured approach to evaluating leads—based on product fit, probability, and alignment with your ICP—leaders can drive better forecasting and higher win rates.

Even modest improvements in key areas like win rate, deal size, and sales cycle length can produce exponential results. We explore how a 7% uptick in core metrics could double your revenue. The message is clear: Clarity, consistency, and customer focus are non-negotiable in 2025.

If you’re looking to future-proof your sales organization, this podcast episode is packed with strategies and examples that can serve as a roadmap. Listen to the full episode and learn how to apply these concepts to your company.


Listen to the Full Episode

This is a powerful episode for CEOs, sales leaders, and anyone responsible for building and leading high-performance sales teams. If you’re ready to equip your team for 2025 and beyond, don’t miss this conversation on the Art and Science of Complex Sales podcast.

🎧 Episode: Building Winning Sales Teams for the Future with Two Tall Guys
🎙 Host: Paul Fuller of Membrain
🔗 https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/building-winning-sales-teams-for-the-future-with-two/id1723340327?i=1000684372709

Click the link to listen now—you’ll walk away with actionable ideas to implement immediately.

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Sales Slumps & Hot Streaks: How to Build a Predictable Pipeline – E122

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Sales Slumps & Hot Streaks: How to Build a Predictable Pipeline – E122

Sales is a game of ups and downs, but what separates top performers from the rest is their ability to keep the funnel full—even when they’re closing deals. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey dive into the art and science of building a consistent pipeline. They discuss strategic approaches to prospecting, leveraging data tools, and the importance of curiosity in sales conversations. Whether you’re starting fresh in Q1 or looking to level up your approach, this episode is packed with actionable insights to keep your sales engine running smoothly.

Key Topics Discussed

🔹 The Sales Roller Coaster – Why salespeople experience cycles of high revenue followed by dry spells and how to smooth out the dips. (00:01:15)

🔹 The First Step: Re-engage Past Clients – Why checking in with existing customers is the easiest way to generate immediate opportunities. (00:02:23)

🔹 Using Free Data Resources to Prospect – How Data Axle and Apollo.io can help salespeople generate lists of high-potential prospects at no cost. (00:03:00)

🔹 Turning Leads Into Prospects – The difference between having a database of names and actually engaging with real sales opportunities. (00:05:31)

🔹 The Power of Networking and Curiosity – How to leverage your network to gain insights about a company before reaching out to decision-makers. (00:10:39)

🔹 Climbing the Ladder to the Decision-Maker – Why you shouldn’t start at the top and how building relationships within an organization can earn you a trusted introduction. (00:14:37)

Key Quotes

💬 Sean O’Shaughnessey on avoiding the sales roller coaster:
“If I go back to my drain-the-swamp analogy, you gotta put water back in the swamp, you gotta let it rain, gotta make it rain.” (00:02:02)

💬 Kevin Lawson on the importance of planning:
“Too often, salespeople stop after the second or third introduction. Timing is everything—keep going, keep networking, and keep qualifying your ideal client profile.” (00:12:39)

💬 Sean O’Shaughnessey on reaching executives:
“You cannot send an email to the CEO and expect it to be read. You are just a salesperson. If you want to sell to the top, you need a referral—and probably from someone lower in the organization.” (00:14:37)

Additional Resources

📌 Data Axle – A powerful business database often available through public libraries. Check with your local library for free access.

📌 Apollo.io – A free tool offering up to 10,000 business contacts per month to help with prospecting.

📌 Lighthouse Sales Advisors Coaching – Kevin Lawson offers 1:1 coaching to help sales professionals refine their strategies. Learn more here.

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast

Take 30 minutes this week to evaluate your sales pipeline using the “circle exercise.”

  1. Draw a circle and estimate what percentage of your revenue will come from existing clients vs. new clients.
  2. Identify how many new deals you need to hit your quota.
  3. Rank your existing leads based on fit and potential.
  4. Develop a networking plan to move from a name on a list to an engaged prospect.

Doing this exercise will give you clarity on where to focus your efforts and how to strategically fill your pipeline.

Why You Should Listen to This Episode

Struggling with an empty pipeline after closing strong last year? You’re not alone. In this fast-paced, insight-packed episode, Kevin and Sean break down the fundamental strategies that separate high-performing salespeople from those stuck on the revenue roller coaster. Whether you’re looking for free prospecting tools, better ways to approach networking, or a foolproof plan to keep your sales funnel full, this episode delivers practical tactics you can apply immediately.

🎧 Tune in now and take control of your sales pipeline!

Understanding Your Customers: The Role of Buyer Personas and Quarterly Business Reviews

Understanding Your Customers: The Role of Buyer Personas and Quarterly Business Reviews

Want to know the real secret behind successful sales? It’s not just about knowing what your customers need. The true power lies in understanding who they are at their core.

Have you ever wondered why some sales professionals consistently outperform their peers? The answer often comes down to their mastery of buyer personas and detailed profiles that capture the essence of your ideal customers.

Think of buyer personas as your secret weapon in the sales battlefield. These aren’t just random customer profiles thrown together in a rushed afternoon meeting. They represent carefully crafted composites of your most valuable clients, built from real-world data and insights. Your company might need several of these personas, each targeting different market segments with laser precision.

Creating effective buyer personas demands more than just surface-level observation. Start with a thorough analysis of your business landscape. Examine your strengths and weaknesses. Map out the opportunities that excite you and the threats that keep you up at night. This foundation helps you understand exactly where you fit in your customers’ world.

What makes your top customers tick? The answer lies in meaningful conversations with your best clients. These discussions should dig deep into both quantitative and qualitative factors. Demographics tell part of the story – age, position, education, family status. But the real gold comes from understanding their motivations. Why did they choose you? What problems do you solve that keep them coming back?

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Driving Sales Performance with Strategic Competitive Analysis

Driving Sales Performance with Strategic Competitive Analysis

Ever wonder why some sales teams consistently outperform their competitors while others struggle to close deals? The answer often lies in how well they understand and leverage competitive analysis in their sales process.

Let’s talk about competitive analysis in sales. It’s not just about knowing your competition – it’s about understanding how to use that knowledge to drive results. You need to grasp why prospects choose specific solutions over others and, more importantly, why they sometimes choose to do nothing at all.

Have you considered how many deals you’ve lost not to competitors but to indecision? These “no decision” outcomes often stem from a fundamental gap in prospect qualification. Intelligent sales professionals dig deeper, asking targeted questions about organizational priorities, resource allocation, and strategic initiatives. They understand that timing can be just as crucial as the solution itself.

The modern sales landscape demands a sophisticated approach to competitive analysis. Your success hinges on aligning your organization’s strengths with your prospect’s needs. But here’s the real question: Do you truly understand what your ideal client values most?

Many sales professionals miss the mark by focusing solely on feature comparisons. While product capabilities matter, they’re just one piece of the puzzle. The real power lies in understanding how your solution addresses your prospect’s challenges. This requires a comprehensive view of your competitive landscape, including direct and indirect competitors.

Think about your last few lost deals. What patterns emerge when you analyze the feedback? Every objection and hesitation after presenting pricing are valuable data points that should shape your competitive strategy. Your sales conversations must reflect a deep understanding of your prospect’s value metrics.

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