Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Building a Sales Powerhouse—The 3 Most Underrated Skills with Jeff Parris – Episode 143

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Building a Sales Powerhouse—The 3 Most Underrated Skills with Jeff Parris – Episode 143

By Sean O'Shaughnessey

Sales isn’t about persuasion but service, resilience, and growth. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, co-hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey welcome sales leader and former professional athlete Jeff Parris to explore the fundamental skills that separate elite salespeople from the rest. Drawing on decades of experience, Jeff shares three often-overlooked yet foundational competencies that drive sales success, and they’re not what you’d expect. Whether you’re a VP of Sales building a high-performance team or a seller looking to level up, this episode delivers sharp insights on value selling, business acumen, and sales management excellence.

Key Topics Discussed

  • Why great salespeople see themselves as servants first (approx. 04:00)
    Jeff outlines why a “motivation to serve” mindset creates stronger client relationships and more consistent revenue generation.
  • Ego Drive vs. Ego Trip: Understanding the will to win without arrogance (approx. 07:30)
    Learn how ego drive, a hunger to persuade for the buyer’s benefit, builds durable sales performance.
  • Curiosity as the gateway to sales mastery (approx. 10:15)
    Jeff and Sean dig into why curiosity fuels continuous improvement and business acumen across every sales process.
  • How to coach the “accidental salesperson” into a top performer (approx. 11:45)
    Kevin asks how people without formal sales backgrounds can thrive by developing the right mindset.
  • Sales leaders as talent architects: Building high-performance teams (approx. 02:00)
    Jeff draws on his athletic past to share what makes a sales team championship-worthy.

Key Quotes

  • “Sales isn’t something we do to people, it’s something we do for people.”
    — Jeff Parris (04:00)
  • “The real goal of a great salesperson is: ‘Mr. Prospect, let me help you solve that problem.”
    — Sean O’Shaughnessey (05:55)
  • “Having the right people, with the right skills, in the right seats makes winning so much easier.”
    — Kevin Lawson (03:36)
  • “Curiosity leads to better solutions. Every interaction is a chance to learn and improve your craft.”
    — Jeff Parris (10:50)

Additional Resources

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast

Evaluate your team (and yourself) on the “Service–Drive–Curiosity” Triad.
Start by asking three questions:

  1. Does this salesperson show a genuine desire to serve the customer’s goals?
  2. Do they take pride in persuading with purpose, not just for commission but impact?
  3. Are they consistently seeking to learn more about the customer, the industry, and their performance?

Use these questions in your next 1-on-1 or team coaching session to align your talent strategy with the kind of sales success that sustains revenue generation.

Why You Should Listen to This Episode

If you’re tired of surface-level sales advice, this conversation will challenge your thinking and expand your toolkit. Jeff Parris brings clarity, conviction, and humility to what it means to lead with purpose in today’s complex B2B landscape. From building elite sales teams to refining your individual sales strategy, this episode is packed with practical wisdom for leaders, sellers, and anyone serious about mastering the craft of sales. Tune in now and discover the underestimated traits that drive extraordinary outcomes.

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Chris Spanier Explains Marketing Professional Services: Sales Strategies That Actually Work – Episode 142

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Chris Spanier Explains Marketing Professional Services: Sales Strategies That Actually Work – Episode 142

By Sean O'Shaughnessey

When marketing professional services, the playbook isn’t the same as product sales, and today’s episode dives into exactly why. Sean O’Shaughnessey and Kevin Lawson are joined by returning guest Chris Spanier, CEO of Carpe Diem Consulting Group and host of the Practical Actionable Marketing podcast. This conversation tackles the nuances of sales strategies for service-based businesses, blending value selling with measurable marketing and aligning both functions for stronger revenue generation. If you’re a business owner, consultant, or fractional executive trying to sharpen your sales processes and improve messaging, this episode is a goldmine of practical advice.

🔑 Key Topics Discussed

  • [02:44] Why traditional product marketing doesn’t work for professional services—and how to adapt
  • [03:46] The importance of measuring marketing effectiveness and integrating KPIs into the sales process
  • [07:36] How to position and market services that don’t have tangible “speeds and feeds”
  • [08:28] Letting go of the fear of “giving away your secret sauce” in thought leadership content
  • [10:30] Systemizing stories and messaging to scale sales efforts across a growing team
  • [12:14] How to use lead nurturing email campaigns to drive engagement and trust over time

🗣️ Key Quotes

  • Sean O’Shaughnessey:
    “Sales is a really expensive marketing arm if you’re not doing really good marketing.”
    — [05:59]
  • Kevin Lawson:
    “Tell how you win, how you help others win, and how they win when working with you—this is as key as anything in professional services.”
    — [10:52]
  • Chris Spanier:
    “If you freely share value, people won’t take advantage of you—they’ll start trusting you. That’s the first step in real sales success.”
    — [08:54]
    “Marketing is half magic and half numbers. But the numbers—that’s where the proof comes in.”
    — [04:14]

📚 Additional Resources

✅ A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast

Systemize your lead nurturing.
Create a recurring, value-focused email campaign to maintain top-of-mind awareness. Whether your cadence is every three or six weeks, focus 80% on providing helpful insights and only 20% on pitching your services. Tracking measures email open rates and clicks, and then the behavior is aligned with site visits or follow-up outreach. This strategy turns occasional touchpoints into consistent momentum, critical for long-cycle sales in professional services.

🎧 Why You Should Listen Now

This episode is packed with strategic clarity and tactical insight for anyone selling invisible services. Whether you’re a fractional executive, consultant, or marketing-savvy sales leader, you’ll leave with a more innovative approach to messaging, a stronger understanding of sales and marketing alignment, and actionable ways to drive revenue generation with business acumen. Tune in now and rethink how you build trust and momentum in your professional services pipeline.

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Elevate Your Sales Game with B2B Sales Lab: A New Resource for Revenue Growth – Episode 141

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Elevate Your Sales Game with B2B Sales Lab: A New Resource for Revenue Growth – Episode 141

By Sean O'Shaughnessey

When sales professionals hit a roadblock, where do they turn? In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey unveil an exciting new initiative: B2B Sales Lab, a private peer networking community designed to support salespeople, sales managers, and business owners in their journey toward revenue generation excellence. This isn’t just a conversation; rather, we are offering an invitation to join something powerful. If you’ve ever felt alone in a tough sales challenge or wished for experienced advice on your messaging, sales processes, or strategy, this episode is for you.

Key Topics Discussed

  • (00:00) Why selling isn’t easy and how sales professionals can benefit from a support network
  • (00:39) The creation and mission of the B2B Sales Lab community
  • (01:42) How the platform fosters peer-to-peer learning without judgment or pressure
  • (02:58) The importance of community in developing strong sales strategies and business acumen
  • (03:54) Guardrails that make this space safer and more effective than LinkedIn or Facebook groups
  • (05:00) Why there’s a membership fee—and why the first three months are free

Key Quotes

  • Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:01:00): “We’re creating a community where people can get together, bounce ideas off each other without fear—just designed to help.”
  • Kevin Lawson (00:02:58): “It’s unreasonable to think your small sales team has all the answers. But it’s completely reasonable to find a community that does.”
  • Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:04:16): “If you’re not a salesperson or sales leader, you’re not getting in. This isn’t about selling to each other. It’s about growing together.”

Additional Resources

  • B2B Sales Lab Information & Registration: https://newsales.expert/b2b-sales-lab
    (Free for the first three months with no obligation.)

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast

Join the B2B Sales Lab.
If you’ve ever wished you had a sounding board for a tough sales call, a creative partner to work through messaging, or a peer to validate your sales strategy, this is your moment. Visit the link in the show notes and apply to join the B2B Sales Lab. The first three months are free, giving you access to experienced sales minds, curated content on value selling and revenue management, and a judgment-free environment to grow your sales acumen. Don’t wait for your next deal to fall through; build your support system today.

Why You Should Listen

This episode is a call to action for sales professionals serious about growth. If you’re navigating complex sales cycles, seeking stronger messaging, or simply want a community that understands your world, the B2B Sales Lab might be the resource you’ve been missing. Kevin and Sean, both seasoned in sales leadership and sales management, offer not just insights but an entire framework to elevate your career. Listen now to learn how to take the next step toward sustainable sales success—and connect with others on the same journey.

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – John McLeod Explains How to Avoid the AI Trap: Using New Tools Without Losing Your Sales Message – Episode 140

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – John McLeod Explains How to Avoid the AI Trap: Using New Tools Without Losing Your Sales Message – Episode 140

By Sean O'Shaughnessey

In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey are joined by veteran fractional VP of Sales, John McLeod. Together, they dive into a critical topic for today’s sales leaders: embracing artificial intelligence tools without compromising your value proposition, messaging, or sales processes. John brings deep expertise in sales management, business acumen, and revenue generation strategies, offering a measured approach to evaluating sales tech, especially AI solutions, through a risk-and-reward lens. Whether you’re a business owner, sales manager, or BDR excited about AI, this conversation grounds you in practical wisdom.

Key Topics Discussed

  • The Real Risk of AI in Sales (00:01:22): How overreliance on untrained AI tools can misrepresent your brand and do more harm than good.
  • Sales Productivity vs. Organizational Efficiency (00:02:01): Why the focus shouldn’t just be on doing more faster, but also on syncing with your company’s value selling model
  • Three Essential AI Use Cases in Sales (00:03:25): Research, qualification, and outreach—and why each comes with its own operational risk.
  • The Ethical Use of AI and Messaging Integrity (00:07:43): Why maintaining consistent messaging across AI-enabled tools is essential to preserving brand integrity and revenue management.
  • Training AI for Sales Value (00:10:00): How smart prompt engineering and structured inputs drive better outcomes from generative AI tools.

Key Quotes

  • John McLeod (00:05:27):
    “AI tools are meant to be trained. The biggest risk is: are they in fact supporting your unique and distinctive value proposition and holding true to that?”
  • Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:11:38):
    “You won’t lose your job to AI—but you might lose it to another salesperson who knows how to use AI more effectively.”
  • Kevin Lawson (00:09:40):
    “When you introduce AI and efficiency, that naturally raises the bar of expectation for performance. What is the new normal when you get there?”

Additional Resources

  • John McLeod’s LinkedIn Profile – https://www.linkedin.com/in/johnmcleod1/

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast

Train Your AI with Purpose: Don’t just “plug and play” AI tools. Take the time to structure your inputs and refine your prompts so that the tool reflects your value, not just generic sales content. Spend time A/B testing different approaches to ensure messaging aligns with your company’s strategic sales positioning. Start today by reviewing your most recent outreach generated by AI and ask: “Does this truly represent our value?” If not, retrain your prompts before using them again.

Why You Should Listen Now

If you’ve ever been tempted by the next great sales tool or AI platform promising instant leads and effortless sales success, this episode will recalibrate your thinking. John McLeod delivers candid insights on balancing tech adoption with strategic discipline. With Sean and Kevin steering the conversation, this discussion is rich with real-world experience in sales management, messaging, and revenue generation. Tune in now to stay ahead without losing what makes your company valuable.

Navigating the Sales Maze: Overcoming Missed Steps in Your Sales Process

Navigating the Sales Maze: Overcoming Missed Steps in Your Sales Process

By Sean O'Shaughnessey

The challenges for a salesperson or a sales manager are numerous. One such challenge that often arises during the sales process is the realization that a crucial step has been skipped. This situation is not uncommon and is faced by many salespeople. However, it’s not a moment for reprimanding or pulling out an accountability chart. Instead, it’s a moment of realization and an opportunity to rectify the error to avoid ending up in the ‘no decision lane.’

I have written about the importance of skipping stages of the sales process elsewhere on this site, most recently in “The Key to Profitable Sales Organizations: Understanding and Adhering to the Sales Process,” where I remind you that, according to the Harvard Business Review, 28% of companies that master at least three stages of their sales process will see an increase in revenue growth.

When you recognize you’ve missed a step in your sales process, it resembles backing up a train. You’ve got a lot of cars put together, but one is out on its own. Addressing this situation requires a specific style and approach. As a sales leader, your focus should be on the next step in the process. Have you covered this step from a question in the sales meeting? It’s important to ask questions like, “What is next? What is missing? What is now?” 

As a salesperson, if you realize you’ve missed a step, address it head-on. This approach allows you to rectify your error and builds trust with your prospect by demonstrating transparency and accountability. 

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Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Patrick O’Donnell Explains How to Hire and Onboard Sales Talent That Actually Performs – Episode 139

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Patrick O’Donnell Explains How to Hire and Onboard Sales Talent That Actually Performs – Episode 139

By Sean O'Shaughnessey

In this high-impact episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey welcome sales acceleration expert Patrick O’Donnell to tackle one of the toughest challenges facing small business CEOs: hiring and onboarding top-performing sales talent. Together, they dive deep into proven sales strategies that help CEOs find strong candidates and keep them engaged, successful, and driving revenue. If you’ve ever hired a salesperson who didn’t work out, or you’re planning to hire your first, this conversation is your roadmap to sales success. From creating a robust onboarding plan to integrating soft skills training and cultural alignment, this episode is packed with value-selling insights you can apply immediately.

Key Topics Discussed:

  • [00:01:00] Why small business CEOs struggle to attract and retain top salespeople
  • [00:03:00] Patrick’s proven hiring and onboarding process for sales roles
  • [00:05:10] The importance of structured 30-60-90 day plans and Sean’s GUTS framework
  • [00:07:00] Kevin’s NASA Plan for onboarding: A granular, hourly approach to early success
  • [00:10:00] The role of soft skills and professional development in retaining talent
  • [00:11:50] A lighthearted look at entrepreneurship: Why Patrick bought a historic Indianapolis tavern

Key Quotes:

  • “They’re in such a hurry to take the sales hat off their head that they hire the first person who looks okay on the surface. That rushed approach almost always ends poorly.”
    – Patrick O’Donnell [00:02:06]
  • “I hand every new rep a GUTS document—Getting Up To Speed. It’s a 30-60-90 plan that clearly spells out what they need to accomplish. They can be ahead, but they can’t fall behind.”
    – Sean O’Shaughnessey [00:05:10]
  • “Most small business owners think they have a plan because it’s in their head. But if it’s not written down, it doesn’t exist.”
    – Kevin Lawson [00:07:29]
  • “We want every new hire to be the most professional person in the company, because it’s their job to make everyone around them better.”
    – Sean O’Shaughnessey [00:10:35]

Additional Resources:

  • LinkedIn profile for Patrick O’Donnell https://www.linkedin.com/in/patrickwodonnell/
  • Soft skills training programs referenced by Sean for onboarding enrichment
  • GUTS (Getting Up To Speed) framework and NASA Plan discussed during onboarding best practices

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast:

Implement a Written 30-60-90 Onboarding Plan with a Two-Week NASA Schedule.
Salespeople need clarity to succeed. Whether you’re a first-time sales manager or a seasoned executive, stop relying on verbal plans or “tribal knowledge.” Create a written 30-60-90 onboarding plan that details expectations, milestones, and key outcomes. For the first two weeks, apply the NASA method: a daily, hour-by-hour schedule that aligns the new hire with every department, cultural cue, and technical requirement. Doing so sets a strong foundation for success and dramatically reduces early turnover.

Summary Paragraph:

If you’re serious about improving your sales management, elevating your sales processes, and building a team that drives real revenue generation, this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales is essential listening. Kevin, Sean, and Patrick break down what too many business owners get wrong—and how you can get it right. Whether you’re scaling a team or hiring your first rep, these insights around onboarding, messaging, and business acumen will accelerate your journey toward consistent sales success. Press play now and walk away with tools you can use today.

The Key to Profitable Sales Organizations: Understanding and Adhering to the Sales Process

The Key to Profitable Sales Organizations: Understanding and Adhering to the Sales Process

By Sean O'Shaughnessey

Many salespeople, sales managers, and CEOs face a unique problem. This issue concerns the sales process, particularly when specific steps are skipped. The challenge is common among sales teams across various industries, and there are different perspectives on its causes and solutions.

This issue is concerning since, according to Harvard Business Review, 28% of companies that master at least three stages of their sales process will see an increase in revenue growth. (https://hbr.org/2015/01/companies-with-a-formal-sales-process-generate-more-revenue). That same study states that companies that had trained their sales managers to manage their pipelines saw their revenue grow 9% faster than those that didn’t. But not just any training will do. Sales managers need targeted training to address specific pipeline management challenges.

Sometimes, the sales process might seem tedious, and salespeople may skip steps out of impatience or eagerness to close a deal. However, skipping these steps can lead to further complications down the line. When a sales team is not following the process that has been identified, it can disrupt the team’s rhythm and efficiency. Some might argue that this is a sign that the process needs to change or that more training is required.

This issue extends beyond the sales team. When a company hires a fractional VP of sales, it brings an outside perspective to evaluate its sales process. The fractional VP will often encounter resistance from the existing team, who may feel their industry is unique. While every business has its distinctive elements, the fundamentals of a sales process are universal.

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Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Mastering Sales Hiring with John Lee – Sales Management Insights for Growth-Focused Teams – Episode 138

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Mastering Sales Hiring with John Lee – Sales Management Insights for Growth-Focused Teams – Episode 138

By Sean O'Shaughnessey

In this week’s episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey are joined by the “Elder Statesman” of fractional sales management: John Lee. With nearly four decades of experience and a deep track record of helping companies hire top-performing sales professionals, John shares a masterclass in sales hiring strategy. Whether you’re scaling from a two-person team to ten or trying to avoid costly hiring mistakes, this episode delivers practical, field-tested advice on building elite sales teams, strengthening your sales processes, and aligning talent with company culture.

Don’t miss this conversation if you’re committed to improving your sales success through smarter hiring, better business acumen, and scalable revenue generation.

Key Topics Discussed:

  • The Hiring Mindset for Growth Companies (00:01:45)
    Why hiring rock stars—not warm bodies—matters and how John filters for high performers.
  • From First Hire to Scaling a Team (00:04:44)
    CEOs and sales leaders must ask the evolving questions when hiring their 3rd, 5th, or 10th rep.
  • Psychographics, Not Just Resumes (00:05:24)
    How John builds candidate profiles that match top performers using behavior and motivation, not just skills.
  • Parallel Sales and Hiring Processes (00:08:00)
    Why a successful sales hiring process mirrors your value selling strategy—with defined steps, assessments, and clear messaging.
  • Avoiding Common Hiring Mistakes (00:11:43)
    The critical danger of hiring salespeople who are better at selling themselves than your solution.
  • Top 3 Rules for Hiring Sales Talent (00:13:33)
    John’s unfiltered checklist for hiring decisions that fuel revenue growth and protect your sales culture.

Key Quotes:

  • John Lee: “Don’t hire someone who can’t show they’ve been successful—and don’t hire someone who doesn’t fit your culture.” (00:13:57)
  • Sean O’Shaughnessey: “A salesperson might not be able to sell your product to save their life—but they’re often great at selling themselves. That’s a trap for business owners.” (00:11:55)
  • Kevin Lawson: “You talk about hiring the way you talk about sales infrastructure—it’s all about process, fit, and purpose.” (00:07:42)

Additional Resources Mentioned:

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast:

Design a Hiring Process Like a Sales Process
Treat your hiring efforts with the same rigor as your sales process. Start by defining a psychographic profile based on your top performers. Use structured assessments to evaluate “sales DNA” and focus interviews on demonstrated success, not just confidence. Then, make cultural fit a deal-breaker. Great hires aren’t just competent—they’re aligned with your mission, methods, and team dynamics.

Summary Paragraph:

This episode is essential listening for sales leaders and business owners looking to scale their teams without sacrificing culture, performance, or momentum. John Lee brings a rare mix of seasoned sales management expertise and real-world hiring acumen to the table. If you want to improve revenue generation through smarter hiring and better sales strategies, you’ll find actionable insights packed into every minute. Don’t settle for average; build a sales team that drives success. Tune in now.

Validation Events: The Unsung Hero of Sales Process Discipline

Validation Events: The Unsung Hero of Sales Process Discipline

By Sean O'Shaughnessey

In the complex world of B2B selling, trust is built in stages. The challenge in all sales campaigns is ensuring the prospect trusts they are making the best decision for their business.

  1. Do they trust that the salesperson is giving them all of the information?
  2. Do they trust that the company will support them after the sale?
  3. Do they trust that the product will perform as they expect it to perform?

As I have explained in my book, Eliminate Your Competition, as well as the blog for that book and in this blog, the prospect needs to trust all three elements the salesperson is selling:

  1. They need to trust the product.
  2. They need to trust the company behind the product.
  3. They need to trust the salesperson.

Prospects listen to your sales message, review your materials, and hear your claims, but none of that guarantees belief or trust. Trust is validated when your claims are validated. That’s why validation events are crucial to any rigorous sales process.

In The Qualified Sales Leader, John McMahon stresses the importance of customer-driven validation. He cautions sales leaders against relying on internal optimism or anecdotal “good signals” from prospects. Instead, McMahon emphasizes observable proof—real buyer behavior that confirms alignment, commitment, and value. Validation events are when the customer takes action to validate that what you’ve promised is accurate and valuable.

An excellent sample sale process flow looks like this:

  1. Discover
  2. Scoping
  3. Economic Buyer Meeting
  4. Validation Event
  5. Business Case and Final Proposal
  6. Negotiate and Close

As you can see, the Validation Event is the last step before creating the final business case, which will be bundled with your final proposal.

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Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Steve Caton Shares When to Sell, When to Coach, and When to Hire: Strategic Sales Management That Drives Growth – Episode 137

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Steve Caton Shares When to Sell, When to Coach, and When to Hire: Strategic Sales Management That Drives Growth – Episode 137

By Sean O'Shaughnessey

In this powerful episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey are joined once again by Steve Caton, CEO of Altezza Solutions, for a thought-provoking conversation that zeroes in on one of the toughest decisions in sales leadership: when to sell, when to coach, and when to hire. Whether you’re a business owner, VP of Sales, or a player-coach juggling a quota and a team, this episode brings clarity to the strategic inflection point where growth hinges on letting go. With frank discussion, lived experience, and tactical advice, Kevin, Sean, and Steve guide you through the complex terrain of sales management, revenue generation, and scaling your team without sacrificing results.

Key Topics Discussed:

  • [00:01:58] The pros and cons of player-coach sales roles, and why this model often fails without intentional strategy
  • [00:05:34] How to create a psychologically safe sales environment where learning from failure drives sales success
  • [00:07:11] Steve Caton’s personal transition from sales operator to CEO—and how it triggered exponential business growth
  • [00:09:20] The difference between hiring to “swim faster” and hiring to scale—how business acumen guides the decision
  • [00:13:00] Real-world use cases for fractional sales roles to test new markets or offerings without disrupting core revenue streams

Key Quotes:

  • Kevin Lawson [00:04:57]: “Sometimes you have to let people fail. You can’t push them into failure, but you do have to give them the room to learn. The challenge is, as a leader, you’re still accountable for that failure.”
  • Sean O’Shaughnessey [00:04:01]: “It’s much easier to do one thing well. Let great salespeople sell and great managers manage—don’t dilute either role.”
  • Steve Caton [00:08:30]: “I made the decision to stop selling before I could afford it. Why? Because I knew the payoff would be big. Sometimes, you just have to invest in your business to grow.”
  • Kevin Lawson [00:11:34]: “A sales process with control metrics, plus intentional feedback loops, informs exactly how and where your business should grow.”

Additional Resources:

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast:

Reevaluate your team structure and decide: are you scaling or surviving?
If you’re a business owner or sales leader wearing multiple hats, it’s time to assess whether you’re enabling growth or capping it. Consider where your time is most valuable—rainmaking, coaching, or closing—and invest in building the right team around you. Start with fractional or part-time hires to test new roles or markets, then double down when the data supports it.

Closing Summary:

This episode cuts through the noise around sales team building with a refreshing mix of vulnerability, experience, and strategic depth. Whether you’re weighing your first sales hire or deciding to step out of the player-coach role, Two Tall Guys Talking Sales delivers real-world sales strategies that help you align your messaging, sales processes, and revenue management decisions with long-term growth. Don’t miss this one—it’s 15 minutes of business-building insight that could change the trajectory of your sales organization. Hit play now and discover how letting go might be the smartest way to grow.