Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Sales Strategies That Outperform AI Tools: ICP, Value Selling, and Revenue Management – Episode 150

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Sales Strategies That Outperform AI Tools: ICP, Value Selling, and Revenue Management – Episode 150

By Sean O'Shaughnessey

In today’s fast-changing sales landscape, everyone is talking about AI, automation, and digital tools, but are these the keys to sales success? In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey explore why documenting your sales processes, defining your ideal client profile (ICP), and sharpening your value selling approach must come before chasing shiny new technologies. Whether you’re leading a sales team or building revenue generation strategies as a business owner, this episode delivers practical advice for aligning business acumen with modern sales strategies.

Key Topics Discussed

  • [00:01:00] The foundational role of sales processes: Why documenting your sales processes is more important than rushing into automation or AI.
  • [00:03:00] Defining your Ideal Client Profile (ICP): How knowing precisely who you should sell to drives revenue management and sales success.
  • [00:06:00] AI without ICP is useless: Kevin explains why AI and automation fail without strong sales strategies and a written ICP.
  • [00:09:00] Automating bad processes makes junk faster: Sean shares insights from decades in sales and automation.
  • [00:12:00] Real growth impact: Data showing how companies with a documented ICP experience higher win rates, deal closure, and long-term revenue generation.

Key Quotes

  • Kevin Lawson [00:06:00]: “AI tools don’t work unless they are programmed to know what you’re trying to look for. If your value proposition and ICP aren’t documented, you’ve basically bought another untrained person.”
  • Sean O’Shaughnessey [00:10:23]: “If you automate a bad process, all you do is make junk faster. Get the basics right first.”
  • Sean O’Shaughnessey [00:12:57]: “Companies with a documented ICP have an account win rate 68% higher than those without one. That’s the power of clarity in sales processes.”

Additional Resources

  • Exclusive whitepapers on Ideal Client Profiles and Value Selling Propositions are available inside the B2B Sales Lab Community. www.b2b-sales-lab.com and go to the Sales Resources section.
  • Previous episode: Winning Sales Strategies for Productive, High-Impact Pipeline Reviews https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/winning-sales-strategies-for-productive-high-impact/id1668686029?i=1000721736213

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast

Write down your Ideal Client Profile (ICP).

Even if you think you already know your best customers, putting it in writing transforms sales management and revenue generation. A written ICP sharpens your messaging, aligns your sales processes, and empowers value selling. Without it, AI tools and automation will fail to deliver meaningful results.

Why You Should Listen

If you’re serious about sales success, this episode is a must. Kevin and Sean break through the noise of AI hype to uncover the timeless truths of revenue management, sales strategies, and business acumen. Learn how to strengthen your sales processes, improve messaging, and drive consistent revenue generation. Packed with stories, data, and practical wisdom, this episode equips you with the clarity needed to win more deals and build long-term sales success.

Cut Through the AI Hype: Practical Definitions for Sales Professionals

Cut Through the AI Hype: Practical Definitions for Sales Professionals

By Sean O'Shaughnessey

Artificial intelligence is transforming sales, but too many leaders are investing in tools they don’t fully understand. The result? Costly mistakes, poor adoption, and missed opportunities. This episode of AI Tools for Sales Pros breaks down the three core technologies behind AI:

  1. Machine Learning (ML),
  2. Natural Language Processing (NLP),
  3. Large Language Models (LLMs)

and explains them in plain language that every sales professional can use.

The episode compares the current AI confusion to the database revolution of the 1990s. Just as sales leaders once needed to grasp relational databases or virtualization to sell effectively, today’s leaders must understand AI fundamentals to buy, implement, and coach effectively. Without this knowledge, vendor meetings become traps where features outshine true solutions.

Why Sales Leaders Need to Understand AI

  • Vendors are selling “AI-powered” tools that are often just automation with marketing polish.
  • ROI depends on knowing what you’re really buying.
  • Sales reps look to leadership for clarity and coaching on new technologies.
  • Competitive advantage comes from strategic implementation, not just adoption.

The Three Core AI Technologies

Machine Learning (ML): The pattern recognition engine. It predicts outcomes by analyzing historical sales data. Use cases: lead scoring, deal risk analysis, forecasting.

Natural Language Processing (NLP): The communication translator. It helps machines understand and analyze human conversations. Use cases: call transcription, sentiment analysis, chatbots, and objection detection.

Large Language Models (LLMs): The content creation powerhouse. They generate human-like content at scale. Use cases: personalized emails, proposals, meeting prep, follow-ups.

When the Technologies Work Together

The magic happens when ML, NLP, and LLMs integrate. Imagine: ML identifies the best prospects, NLP uncovers their communication style, and LLMs create personalized outreach. Companies are seeing 30%+ response rates with this integrated approach.

Misconceptions and Realities

  • Myth: AI replaces humans. Reality: It augments judgment.
  • Myth: More AI equals better results. Reality: Focused use beats scattered adoption.
  • Myth: AI requires massive data. Reality: Many sales AI tools work with modest data sets.

Action Steps for Sales Leaders

  1. Audit your current tools—identify which technologies you’re already using.
  2. Apply the vendor evaluation framework before making new purchases.
  3. Share these simplified definitions with your team.
  4. Connect with peers in the B2B Sales Lab community to learn from real implementations.

AI competency isn’t about programming—it’s about making better buying decisions and leading your sales team strategically. The future of B2B sales is not humans vs. AI—it’s humans amplified by AI.

👉 Register for your free 90-day membership at b2b-sales-lab.com and join the conversation.

AI in B2B Sales Isn’t Optional Anymore

AI in B2B Sales Isn’t Optional Anymore

By Sean O'Shaughnessey

Several months ago, I was serving as a fractional VP of Sales for a $50 million manufacturing company. Their top salesperson was a 15-year veteran who knew the industry inside and out. Yet he was consistently being outsold by a competitor’s much newer hire. At first, it didn’t make sense until we discovered the reason.

The competitor’s rep wasn’t just more energetic or aggressive. They were AI-enabled. While my client’s rep was manually scrolling LinkedIn and drafting emails from scratch, the competitor’s rep was using AI tools to research prospects, craft personalized outreach, and prepare for meetings. In other words, the competitor had a partner working 24/7—freeing them to focus on what humans do best: building trust and closing deals.

That was the turning point. I realized we weren’t just competing against other salespeople anymore. We were competing against AI-enhanced sales teams.

The Most Urgent Technology Wave in Sales

Throughout my career, I’ve watched new technology waves disrupt the sales profession. Robotics transformed manufacturing in the 1980s. Solid modeling replaced drafting tables in the 1990s. Cloud computing reshaped IT in the 2000s.

Each time, early adopters gained the edge while laggards struggled to catch up. The AI wave is different for two reasons:

  1. It’s broader: touching every aspect of sales, from prospecting to forecasting.
  2. It’s faster: companies have months, not years, to adapt before the competitive gap becomes overwhelming.

AI in sales isn’t coming. It’s already here.

The Four Pillars of AI Sales Transformation

To make sense of AI’s role in sales, I use a framework I call the Four Pillars of AI Sales Transformation.

1. Efficiency Amplification

Salespeople lose hours each week on research, data entry, and administrative tasks. AI automates these repetitive activities, turning wasted time into revenue-generating capacity. If a rep with a $2 million quota spends 40% of their time on admin work, reclaiming even half of that time can translate into hundreds of thousands of dollars in additional revenue potential.

2. Personalization at Scale

Buyers expect relevance. AI enables sales teams to tailor outreach at a scale that was previously impossible. One client of mine went from producing 10 personalized emails per day to 500, each one referencing company news, industry pain points, or competitive dynamics. The result: higher engagement and faster response times.

3. Predictive Intelligence

AI spots patterns humans miss. It identifies which deals are at risk, when prospects are most likely to respond, and which leads are worth pursuing first. For one client, simply shifting demos to Tuesday afternoons increased conversion rates by 40%. When your competitors are guessing, AI gives you confidence.

4. Continuous Learning & Optimization

Unlike static playbooks, AI evolves. It analyzes win/loss data, tests messaging, and provides real-time coaching insights. One client discovered that pricing discussions were their biggest choke point. AI flagged the pattern, we built automated battlecards, and close rates improved by 18%.

Real-World Results

These aren’t theoretical benefits. In my own client work:

  • An AI-powered prospecting rollout increased appointment-setting rates from 8% to 23% in just six weeks.
  • A lost-deal analysis uncovered patterns that helped recover $2 million in the pipeline.

The reality is clear: companies already experimenting with AI are pulling ahead. Those who delay are watching the gap widen daily.

Three Things You Can Do This Month

If you’re ready to start, here are three immediate steps:

  1. Audit your workflow. Identify one repetitive task you can automate—prospect research, meeting prep, or follow-up emails.
  2. Pilot an AI tool. Start small with an affordable, no-code platform. Many cost less than $200/month.
  3. Learn with others. Don’t navigate this change alone. Surround yourself with peers who are experimenting, learning, and winning with AI.

Join the B2B Sales Lab

The best way to accelerate your adoption is to connect with others on the same journey. That’s why we built the B2B Sales Lab, a private, member-led community for sales professionals who want actionable insights, not theory. It’s where strategy meets execution.

In the Lab, you can:

  • Ask real questions about sales challenges.
  • Share proven best practices.
  • Learn from other sales professionals and veteran leaders.

Your first 90 days are free. Join us today at b2b-sales-lab.com.

The future of B2B sales isn’t about choosing between humans and AI. It’s about humans amplified by AI. Those who adapt now will thrive. Those who wait may not get the chance to catch up.

To learn more, listen to this podcast on the subject.

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Managing the Maverick: How to Lead Top Sales Performers Without Breaking Team Culture – Episode 146

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Managing the Maverick: How to Lead Top Sales Performers Without Breaking Team Culture – Episode 146

By Sean O'Shaughnessey

When a top-performing salesperson refuses to follow the rules, tensions flare, and your culture might suffer. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey tackle a question straight from their B2B Sales Lab community: What do you do with a sales rockstar who drives the rest of the team nuts? If you’ve ever struggled with managing high-output, low-alignment team members, this conversation is packed with valuable insights, practical strategies, and real-world advice to help you strike a balance between performance and healthy team dynamics. Tune in for battle-tested tips on sales management, building a high-integrity sales culture, and protecting your company’s long-term revenue generation strategy.

Key Topics Discussed

  • Establishing Clear Norms in Sales Teams – Why your “top dog” needs to play by the same rules as everyone else, and how undefined expectations damage sales processes (Approx. 02:00)
  • The Power of Documented Standards and Culture Alignment – How lack of structure in small businesses creates room for chaos—and what to do about it (Approx. 03:30)
  • Tactical Solutions for Managing Lone Wolves – Real examples of how to realign high performers through mentorship and responsibility (Approx. 09:00)
  • Creating a Unified Sales Culture Without Crushing Performance – Why culture eats strategy for breakfast, especially in sales teams (Approx. 04:30)
  • Using Silence, Expectations, and Consistency to Set Boundaries – Kevin shares how saying “no” and standing firm protects team cohesion and customer relationships (Approx. 12:00)

Key Quotes

  • “Culture is probably the most important thing you possibly can have—and it starts with setting clear expectations.”
    — Sean O’Shaughnessey (Approx. 06:05)
  • “Sales culture will eat strategy for breakfast. Culture always wins in the long run.”
    — Kevin Lawson (Approx. 04:39)
  • “Sometimes you have to accept a little current pain to create future gain for your entire organization.”
    — Kevin Lawson (Approx. 13:00)
  • “If you’re the person who colors outside the lines and won’t adjust… maybe you just don’t belong here.”
    — Sean O’Shaughnessey (Approx. 08:30)

Additional Resources

  • Learn more about the B2B Sales Lab community: https://b2b-sales-lab.com

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast

Assign a High-Performer as a Mentor to Drive Culture Alignment
If you’re dealing with a rule-breaking top performer, try this: assign them as a mentor to a junior rep. This strategic move puts them in a leadership position where they must model the very behavior they’ve been resisting, updating the CRM, following your sales strategies, and representing your company messaging. This peer responsibility often encourages cultural realignment without confrontation.


Why You Should Listen to This Episode

This episode is a must-listen for sales managers, business owners, and team leaders wrestling with the dilemma of performance vs. process. Sean and Kevin don’t just talk theory—they give real, implementable strategies that can help you protect your sales culture, enforce consistent sales management practices, and drive long-term revenue success. If you’re aiming for scalable growth without sacrificing team cohesion, this episode delivers practical wisdom and a few gut-check moments. Hit play and discover how to bring even the most independent salespeople back into the fold—without losing their fire.

B2B Sales in the Age of AI: Why Top Salespeople Will Thrive While the Repetitive Roles Disappear

B2B Sales in the Age of AI: Why Top Salespeople Will Thrive While the Repetitive Roles Disappear

By Sean O'Shaughnessey

The buzz surrounding artificial intelligence has left many professionals wondering about the future of their careers. For B2B sales professionals, the rise of AI presents a fundamental question: Will AI replace salespeople?

The short answer is no, but it will replace some of their work. More accurately, AI will redefine the B2B sales landscape by eliminating lower-value activities, consolidating support roles, and enhancing the capabilities of top performers. In doing so, it will widen the gap between average and great salespeople.

Several years ago, I wrote a similar explanation about the fear that “the internet” would replace salespeople. That didn’t happen. You can find that article on the blog that supports my first sales book. Are salespeople necessary in the Internet age?

This blog post explores how B2B sales is positioned relative to AI disruption, referencing key insights from Benjamin Todd’s article, “How Not to Lose Your Job to AI” (80,000 Hours, 2025). Todd’s framework on skill types that increase in value in the age of AI helps us understand how high-functioning sales teams should evolve and how sales professionals can future-proof their careers.

Understanding AI’s True Impact: Augmentation, Not Replacement

A common misconception about AI is that it simply replaces humans. This isn’t true. AI devalues tasks it can perform while increasing the importance of the skills it cannot. Todd explains this dynamic through examples like the ATM: while the ATM reduced the need for transactional teller tasks, it actually increased demand for bank branch workers by allowing banks to open more branches. AI follows a similar pattern.

In B2B sales, AI will handle the most automatable tasks, such as data entry, follow-ups, list-building, and basic prospecting emails. However, this doesn’t eliminate the sales role; it sharpens its focus.

Instead of dialing hundreds of prospects daily, sales professionals will focus more on strategic engagement, account planning, and using AI-generated insights to elevate conversations. The result? Sales has become a more thoughtful, human, and strategic discipline for those who can keep up.

Four Categories of Skills That AI Will Make More Valuable

In Todd’s excellent article, he identifies four skill types that increase in value in an AI-enhanced workplace:

  1. Hard-to-automate skills
  2. Deployment-related skills
  3. Scarce, high-utility skills
  4. Skills hard for others to learn or replicate

Each of these aligns tightly with the demands of modern B2B sales.

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Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Building a Sales Powerhouse—The 3 Most Underrated Skills with Jeff Parris – Episode 143

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Building a Sales Powerhouse—The 3 Most Underrated Skills with Jeff Parris – Episode 143

By Sean O'Shaughnessey

Sales isn’t about persuasion but service, resilience, and growth. In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, co-hosts Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey welcome sales leader and former professional athlete Jeff Parris to explore the fundamental skills that separate elite salespeople from the rest. Drawing on decades of experience, Jeff shares three often-overlooked yet foundational competencies that drive sales success, and they’re not what you’d expect. Whether you’re a VP of Sales building a high-performance team or a seller looking to level up, this episode delivers sharp insights on value selling, business acumen, and sales management excellence.

Key Topics Discussed

  • Why great salespeople see themselves as servants first (approx. 04:00)
    Jeff outlines why a “motivation to serve” mindset creates stronger client relationships and more consistent revenue generation.
  • Ego Drive vs. Ego Trip: Understanding the will to win without arrogance (approx. 07:30)
    Learn how ego drive, a hunger to persuade for the buyer’s benefit, builds durable sales performance.
  • Curiosity as the gateway to sales mastery (approx. 10:15)
    Jeff and Sean dig into why curiosity fuels continuous improvement and business acumen across every sales process.
  • How to coach the “accidental salesperson” into a top performer (approx. 11:45)
    Kevin asks how people without formal sales backgrounds can thrive by developing the right mindset.
  • Sales leaders as talent architects: Building high-performance teams (approx. 02:00)
    Jeff draws on his athletic past to share what makes a sales team championship-worthy.

Key Quotes

  • “Sales isn’t something we do to people, it’s something we do for people.”
    — Jeff Parris (04:00)
  • “The real goal of a great salesperson is: ‘Mr. Prospect, let me help you solve that problem.”
    — Sean O’Shaughnessey (05:55)
  • “Having the right people, with the right skills, in the right seats makes winning so much easier.”
    — Kevin Lawson (03:36)
  • “Curiosity leads to better solutions. Every interaction is a chance to learn and improve your craft.”
    — Jeff Parris (10:50)

Additional Resources

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast

Evaluate your team (and yourself) on the “Service–Drive–Curiosity” Triad.
Start by asking three questions:

  1. Does this salesperson show a genuine desire to serve the customer’s goals?
  2. Do they take pride in persuading with purpose, not just for commission but impact?
  3. Are they consistently seeking to learn more about the customer, the industry, and their performance?

Use these questions in your next 1-on-1 or team coaching session to align your talent strategy with the kind of sales success that sustains revenue generation.

Why You Should Listen to This Episode

If you’re tired of surface-level sales advice, this conversation will challenge your thinking and expand your toolkit. Jeff Parris brings clarity, conviction, and humility to what it means to lead with purpose in today’s complex B2B landscape. From building elite sales teams to refining your individual sales strategy, this episode is packed with practical wisdom for leaders, sellers, and anyone serious about mastering the craft of sales. Tune in now and discover the underestimated traits that drive extraordinary outcomes.

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Elevate Your Sales Game with B2B Sales Lab: A New Resource for Revenue Growth – Episode 141

Two Tall Guys Talking Sales – Elevate Your Sales Game with B2B Sales Lab: A New Resource for Revenue Growth – Episode 141

By Sean O'Shaughnessey

When sales professionals hit a roadblock, where do they turn? In this episode of Two Tall Guys Talking Sales, Kevin Lawson and Sean O’Shaughnessey unveil an exciting new initiative: B2B Sales Lab, a private peer networking community designed to support salespeople, sales managers, and business owners in their journey toward revenue generation excellence. This isn’t just a conversation; rather, we are offering an invitation to join something powerful. If you’ve ever felt alone in a tough sales challenge or wished for experienced advice on your messaging, sales processes, or strategy, this episode is for you.

Key Topics Discussed

  • (00:00) Why selling isn’t easy and how sales professionals can benefit from a support network
  • (00:39) The creation and mission of the B2B Sales Lab community
  • (01:42) How the platform fosters peer-to-peer learning without judgment or pressure
  • (02:58) The importance of community in developing strong sales strategies and business acumen
  • (03:54) Guardrails that make this space safer and more effective than LinkedIn or Facebook groups
  • (05:00) Why there’s a membership fee—and why the first three months are free

Key Quotes

  • Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:01:00): “We’re creating a community where people can get together, bounce ideas off each other without fear—just designed to help.”
  • Kevin Lawson (00:02:58): “It’s unreasonable to think your small sales team has all the answers. But it’s completely reasonable to find a community that does.”
  • Sean O’Shaughnessey (00:04:16): “If you’re not a salesperson or sales leader, you’re not getting in. This isn’t about selling to each other. It’s about growing together.”

Additional Resources

  • B2B Sales Lab Information & Registration: https://newsales.expert/b2b-sales-lab
    (Free for the first three months with no obligation.)

A Significant Actionable Item from this Podcast

Join the B2B Sales Lab.
If you’ve ever wished you had a sounding board for a tough sales call, a creative partner to work through messaging, or a peer to validate your sales strategy, this is your moment. Visit the link in the show notes and apply to join the B2B Sales Lab. The first three months are free, giving you access to experienced sales minds, curated content on value selling and revenue management, and a judgment-free environment to grow your sales acumen. Don’t wait for your next deal to fall through; build your support system today.

Why You Should Listen

This episode is a call to action for sales professionals serious about growth. If you’re navigating complex sales cycles, seeking stronger messaging, or simply want a community that understands your world, the B2B Sales Lab might be the resource you’ve been missing. Kevin and Sean, both seasoned in sales leadership and sales management, offer not just insights but an entire framework to elevate your career. Listen now to learn how to take the next step toward sustainable sales success—and connect with others on the same journey.

Navigating the Sales Maze: Overcoming Missed Steps in Your Sales Process

Navigating the Sales Maze: Overcoming Missed Steps in Your Sales Process

By Sean O'Shaughnessey

The challenges for a salesperson or a sales manager are numerous. One such challenge that often arises during the sales process is the realization that a crucial step has been skipped. This situation is not uncommon and is faced by many salespeople. However, it’s not a moment for reprimanding or pulling out an accountability chart. Instead, it’s a moment of realization and an opportunity to rectify the error to avoid ending up in the ‘no decision lane.’

I have written about the importance of skipping stages of the sales process elsewhere on this site, most recently in “The Key to Profitable Sales Organizations: Understanding and Adhering to the Sales Process,” where I remind you that, according to the Harvard Business Review, 28% of companies that master at least three stages of their sales process will see an increase in revenue growth.

When you recognize you’ve missed a step in your sales process, it resembles backing up a train. You’ve got a lot of cars put together, but one is out on its own. Addressing this situation requires a specific style and approach. As a sales leader, your focus should be on the next step in the process. Have you covered this step from a question in the sales meeting? It’s important to ask questions like, “What is next? What is missing? What is now?” 

As a salesperson, if you realize you’ve missed a step, address it head-on. This approach allows you to rectify your error and builds trust with your prospect by demonstrating transparency and accountability. 

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Validation Events: The Unsung Hero of Sales Process Discipline

Validation Events: The Unsung Hero of Sales Process Discipline

By Sean O'Shaughnessey

In the complex world of B2B selling, trust is built in stages. The challenge in all sales campaigns is ensuring the prospect trusts they are making the best decision for their business.

  1. Do they trust that the salesperson is giving them all of the information?
  2. Do they trust that the company will support them after the sale?
  3. Do they trust that the product will perform as they expect it to perform?

As I have explained in my book, Eliminate Your Competition, as well as the blog for that book and in this blog, the prospect needs to trust all three elements the salesperson is selling:

  1. They need to trust the product.
  2. They need to trust the company behind the product.
  3. They need to trust the salesperson.

Prospects listen to your sales message, review your materials, and hear your claims, but none of that guarantees belief or trust. Trust is validated when your claims are validated. That’s why validation events are crucial to any rigorous sales process.

In The Qualified Sales Leader, John McMahon stresses the importance of customer-driven validation. He cautions sales leaders against relying on internal optimism or anecdotal “good signals” from prospects. Instead, McMahon emphasizes observable proof—real buyer behavior that confirms alignment, commitment, and value. Validation events are when the customer takes action to validate that what you’ve promised is accurate and valuable.

An excellent sample sale process flow looks like this:

  1. Discover
  2. Scoping
  3. Economic Buyer Meeting
  4. Validation Event
  5. Business Case and Final Proposal
  6. Negotiate and Close

As you can see, the Validation Event is the last step before creating the final business case, which will be bundled with your final proposal.

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